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In fact, South had ♣K-x so 620 was available.
Naturally, East & West each thought the other should have acted.
What say you?
Judge this Just a partscore ....
#1
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Posted 2008-August-29, 03:46
In fact, South had ♣K-x so 620 was available.
Naturally, East & West each thought the other should have acted.
What say you?
#2
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Posted 2008-August-29, 03:53
I would have doubled with the West hand and I would not have reopened with the East hand.
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#3 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-August-29, 03:55
West had an obvious X of 1S, east an obvious pass after 1S p p.
#4
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Posted 2008-August-29, 04:12
I agree with East and West. 
West has to bid. With the AQJx suit being hearts, double seems pretty normal. If the AQJx suit was another suit, I would actually overcall 1NT instead (won't be popular on the forums.) But Pass is very weird.
I would also double as East, with a heart suit and a doubleton spade. Admittedly acting as East is not as clearcut as acting with the West cards.
West has to bid. With the AQJx suit being hearts, double seems pretty normal. If the AQJx suit was another suit, I would actually overcall 1NT instead (won't be popular on the forums.) But Pass is very weird.
I would also double as East, with a heart suit and a doubleton spade. Admittedly acting as East is not as clearcut as acting with the West cards.
That's impossible. No one can give more than one hundred percent. By definition that is the most anyone can give.
#5
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Posted 2008-August-29, 04:39
I would pass on the West hand and bid 2H on the East hand.
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Posted 2008-August-29, 04:44
x on west, don't understand pass. torn between pass and 2h on east
#7
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Posted 2008-August-29, 05:07
Hi,
as West I would have overcalled 1NT, but this
is certainly not standart, and your partner (and
the opponents) need to know this.
If you cant overcall 1NT, I think you have to make
a t/o. With the East hand, I would pass, for me a
2H overcall in passout, will not look much different
as in direct seat.
With kind regards
Marlowe
as West I would have overcalled 1NT, but this
is certainly not standart, and your partner (and
the opponents) need to know this.
If you cant overcall 1NT, I think you have to make
a t/o. With the East hand, I would pass, for me a
2H overcall in passout, will not look much different
as in direct seat.
With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
#8
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Posted 2008-August-29, 05:10
FrancesHinden, on Aug 29 2008, 12:39 PM, said:
I would pass on the West hand and bid 2H on the East hand.
Different countries, different style. I would double with the West hand (1NT a second choice and pass a third). If West passes, I would not re-open with East's cards.
Roland
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#9
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Posted 2008-August-29, 06:00
Interesting. Guess in France,mainstream attitude would be to pass west hand and reopen with 2H in east seat (at least it is consistent). I would probably double with West hand (think passing puts too much pressure on east) but that action would be marginal over here
#10
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Posted 2008-August-29, 07:15
I'd double with West's cards - this is obvious.
With East's cards it's more complicated. What is the range of the 1♠ opening? If it's a 12-15 - I double. If the opening can be with 16 or more - then pass or 2♥
With East's cards it's more complicated. What is the range of the 1♠ opening? If it's a 12-15 - I double. If the opening can be with 16 or more - then pass or 2♥
#11
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Posted 2008-August-29, 08:09
I would overcall 1NT. I'm all in favor of doubling with 3433 shape, but the shape plus the strength seems right.
Double would be OK.
Pass? LOL
1NT may get us to an aggressive 4♥. Apparently that would be a good thing.
Double would be OK.
Pass? LOL
1NT may get us to an aggressive 4♥. Apparently that would be a good thing.
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#12
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Posted 2008-August-29, 08:53
FrancesHinden, on Aug 29 2008, 05:39 AM, said:
I would pass on the West hand and bid 2H on the East hand.
Frances accidentally posted the opposite of the only reasonable answer. Don't worry we forgive you
Please let me know about any questions or interest or bug reports about GIB.
#13
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Posted 2008-August-29, 09:23
I echo those who would double as West. 1N is too dangerous with Qxx of spades and a rock-bottom minimum. It's the kind of call that you know is probably irretrievably wrong if LHO says double, whereas if you double and it goes redouble the opps don't always get the ensuing scramble right.
I would pass as East if west passed.
I would pass as East if west passed.
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Posted 2008-August-29, 09:42
I'd definitely bid 1NT with the west hand, and I'd flip a mental coin between pass and 2♥ on the east hand. I don't consider the west hand a "rock bottom minimum" with multiple tenaces behind the opener. You're only in 1 unless partner moves forward, and if he does, then it's even less likely that North has the cards behind your minor honors.
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C. It's the nexus of the crisis and the origin of storms.
IV: ace 333: pot should be game, idk
e: "Maybe God remembered how cute you were as a carrot."
#15
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Posted 2008-August-29, 10:57
Difficult cards for West IMO. For me there is *just* enough high cards in this to make it right for a 1NT overcall - but Q9x is a sorry looking stopper. Like Frances my initial reaction was pass - but eugh - if I pass I put too much pressure on partner to re-open with really not much at all. Double I hate but it may be the least of all evils.
Nick
Nick
"Pass is your friend" - my brother in law - who likes to bid a lot.
#16
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Posted 2008-August-29, 12:02
Nobody did anything terrible. Both positions are reasonable, but I'm closer to a balance with East than a double with West.
"Phil" on BBO
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Posted 2008-August-29, 12:48
shevek, on Aug 29 2008, 04:46 AM, said:
Scoring: IMP
We passed out South's 1S opening.
We passed out South's 1S opening.
In fact, South had ♣K-x so 620 was available.
Naturally, East & West each thought the other should have acted.
What say you?
x by west
did not know there was an issue here.
#18
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Posted 2008-August-29, 13:18
70% for West
20% for East
10% for bad luck.
Whether you consider the West hand a good 1NT overcall or you don't, I think it is wrong for West to pass. If not 1NT then double.
20% for East
10% for bad luck.
Whether you consider the West hand a good 1NT overcall or you don't, I think it is wrong for West to pass. If not 1NT then double.
#19 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-August-29, 13:21
This thread is shocking!
Why is anyone passing the west hand, I honestly don't understand. It get's you in immediately and allows partner to compete knowing you have values and support for the other suits. It eliminates any need to guess whether or not to come in later. It eliminates any chance that they steal a cold game from you, either by LHO bidding and partner not being able to come in with some shapely hand with not many HCP, or with partner having a balanced 10-12 count that won't be able to bid (even if LHO passes, what is partner going to do with a random balanced 10? Pass.) It seems good for both game and partscore bidding. We are not even over bidding, so I'm not worried about getting too high. Is the concern that partner will over compete on a partscore hand or what? I am baffled by all of these passes. Our 4 card suit is even hearts!
As for people balancing on the east hand, how can you ever avoid getting too high? If partner is really catering to you having a balanced 8 count then how do you avoid missing games when you have normal values? You are already at the 2 level and there is not exactly a lot of room to explore.
I'll be honest I think passing with the west hand qualifies as "terrible" (not to say that the people who advocate it in this thread are terrible, but I do think they're way off in this case). I think it is even worse than 1N which I don't have kind thoughts about either.
Why is anyone passing the west hand, I honestly don't understand. It get's you in immediately and allows partner to compete knowing you have values and support for the other suits. It eliminates any need to guess whether or not to come in later. It eliminates any chance that they steal a cold game from you, either by LHO bidding and partner not being able to come in with some shapely hand with not many HCP, or with partner having a balanced 10-12 count that won't be able to bid (even if LHO passes, what is partner going to do with a random balanced 10? Pass.) It seems good for both game and partscore bidding. We are not even over bidding, so I'm not worried about getting too high. Is the concern that partner will over compete on a partscore hand or what? I am baffled by all of these passes. Our 4 card suit is even hearts!
As for people balancing on the east hand, how can you ever avoid getting too high? If partner is really catering to you having a balanced 8 count then how do you avoid missing games when you have normal values? You are already at the 2 level and there is not exactly a lot of room to explore.
I'll be honest I think passing with the west hand qualifies as "terrible" (not to say that the people who advocate it in this thread are terrible, but I do think they're way off in this case). I think it is even worse than 1N which I don't have kind thoughts about either.
#20
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Posted 2008-August-29, 13:22
mikeh, on Aug 29 2008, 10:23 AM, said:
I echo those who would double as West. 1N is too dangerous with Qxx of spades and a rock-bottom minimum. It's the kind of call that you know is probably irretrievably wrong if LHO says double, whereas if you double and it goes redouble the opps don't always get the ensuing scramble right.
I would pass as East if west passed.
I would pass as East if west passed.
I was actually thinking somewhat contra. 1NT as an overcall takes no real space away from our side, as 1♠-X leaves us at the same level in the event of a trap, as there seems to be little chance that partner would opt to convert the double. However, 1NT now is more feasible as a right landing zone, and more in reach.
As opposed to that, if the auction should actually be constructive for our side, 1NT seems to place us better.
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We passed out South's 1S opening.